Rotten hog troughs

[pantera928]

Is this an example of what is meant by rusted hog troughs? If so, what kind of cost would it be to replace them.

This car looks beautiful as far as the body and interior goes but this looks bad.

 

Thanks

[adamderosa]

This Avanti appears to have extensive frame corrosion in addition to rusted out hog troughs. It would be expensive to repair. Finding another solid frame would probably be less expensive than repairing this one. With rust this severe the A-pillars around the windshield should be inspected too. This will require removal of the stainless trim around the windshield. 

[studegary]

You do not say what year, but it is posted in the '65 - '83 section.  I would advise you to run, not walk, away from this Avanti II.  I see the repairs as costing more to have someone fix than the car will be worth.

[Jim78]

1 hour ago, studegary said:

You do not say what year, but it is posted in the '65 - '83 section.  I would advise you to run, not walk, away from this Avanti II.  I see the repairs as costing more to have someone fix than the car will be worth.

Well said.  Run, don't walk.  These repairs would put you deeply under water on any Avanti II.

[pantera928]

It is a 1967 supposedly but the number more seems like a 1966.

THe paint and interior or in great shape but it looks like a major project to bring it back to spec.

I have been reading about hog troughs and some say that they are not truly needed  but serious lark frame rust is another matter.

The body has no sag what so ever which strange.

Picture of the paint

Edited October 1, 2021 by pantera928

[Avanti83]

The hog troughs hold several of the body mounts. Studebaker engineers seemed to think they are important enough to spend a fair bit of money designing and installing them. There are alternate ways to support the body but personally I'll stick with the original method.

Rule of thumb on HT replacement is $4-5K. Frame rust can be repaired if it's isolated to small vertical sections of the frame and/or the bottom plate. But unless you own this one, repair is not for the faint of heart, so as suggested above, Run.

[studegary]

Resale Red.  Out of curiosity, what is the Serial Number?   The "S" on the hood has been added.  I would be more concerned with the frame rust than the torque box rust.   

[pantera928]

RQA-0043

The car has sat in a garage for 4 years since the owner passed suddenly and unexpectedly.

His wife is now trying to sell this and several other older cars(no Stude/Avants).

It was painted many years before he passed and he drove it regularly to shows.

Edited October 1, 2021 by pantera928

[studegary]

6 hours ago, pantera928 said:

RQA-0043

The car has sat in a garage for 4 years since the owner passed suddenly and unexpectedly.

His wife is now trying to sell this and several other older cars(no Stude/Avants).

It was painted many years before he passed and he drove it regularly to shows.

IMO, that is a 1965 model Avanti II.

[pantera928]

5 minutes ago, studegary said:

IMO, that is a 1965 model Avanti II.

I was thinking 1966 based on the number. Not sure how they came up with 1967

[Dwight FitzSimons]

That frame would not be considered repairable by any sane person.  My '64 had a frame that looked much better, with rust all over, but no holes.  My restoration shop (WCD Garage) pulled the body off the frame then showed me how one could twist the frame (The metal was so thin due to corrosion).  My car got a new frame (and hog troughs).

RQA-0043 is listed on Bob Johnstone's website as a 1966 model.  There is a local Avanti II that is titled as a "1967 Studebaker Avanti".  By serial number it is the first 1968 Avanti II built, and has the side marker lights ('68 was first year for them).  I would guess that it was titled in the Fall of 1967.  These things happen.

-Dwight

[studegary]

1 hour ago, Dwight FitzSimons said:

That frame would not be considered repairable by any sane person.  My '64 had a frame that looked much better, with rust all over, but no holes.  My restoration shop (WCD Garage) pulled the body off the frame then showed me how one could twist the frame (The metal was so thin due to corrosion).  My car got a new frame (and hog troughs).

RQA-0043 is listed on Bob Johnstone's website as a 1966 model.  There is a local Avanti II that is titled as a "1967 Studebaker Avanti".  By serial number it is the first 1968 Avanti II built, and has the side marker lights ('68 was first year for them).  I would guess that it was titled in the Fall of 1967.  These things happen.

-Dwight

I just looked in John Hull's book and, like me, he considers it to be a 1965.  Of course, built in late 1965, some consider it to be a 1966 and it may not have been titled until 1967.

[pantera928]

Well, knowing a little bit more about this car, I am betting it is a "Bill of Sale" car and the original title is history.

It was supposedly discovered in a junkyard in North Carolina about 20 years ago and "restored" by the deceased husband of the lady who has it now along with a lot of other car projects he left behind.

I gave Bob the info for his website and that is why it is listed as a 1966.

8 hours ago, Dwight FitzSimons said:

That frame would not be considered repairable by any sane person.  My '64 had a frame that looked much better, with rust all over, but no holes.  My restoration shop (WCD Garage) pulled the body off the frame then showed me how one could twist the frame (The metal was so thin due to corrosion).  My car got a new frame (and hog troughs).

RQA-0043 is listed on Bob Johnstone's website as a 1966 model.  There is a local Avanti II that is titled as a "1967 Studebaker Avanti".  By serial number it is the first 1968 Avanti II built, and has the side marker lights ('68 was first year for them).  I would guess that it was titled in the Fall of 1967.  These things happen.

-Dwight

Scary about the twisty frame!

[Gunslinger]

8 hours ago, studegary said:

I just looked in John Hull's book and, like me, he considers it to be a 1965.  Of course, built in late 1965, some consider it to be a 1966 and it may not have been titled until 1967.

Avanti Motors played some games when titling cars.  Some were titled to whatever year they were sold until the feds came out with rules against such things.  I don't know whether Avanti Motors followed model years like the big automakers did...September to September or by calendar year...maybe it was whichever was most convenient to make the sale.  Even automakers today have pretty fluid model year designations.  

[studegary]

2 hours ago, Gunslinger said:

Avanti Motors played some games when titling cars.  Some were titled to whatever year they were sold until the feds came out with rules against such things.  I don't know whether Avanti Motors followed model years like the big automakers did...September to September or by calendar year...maybe it was whichever was most convenient to make the sale.  Even automakers today have pretty fluid model year designations.  

I believe that the early Avanti IIs used the calendar year for the model year.  Now, automakers can use anything after Jan. 1 of the previous calendar year for a model year.

[Skip Lackie]

Our current concern with ID-ing the exact model year started when the first emissions and safety regs were issued in the mid-60s.  Although we usually think of them starting in a certain model year, the federal regs actually become effective on January 1 each year.  The car manufacturers don't want to change equipment every 1 January, so they adopt the standards early during model-year change-over.  I have a 74 Avanti that was built late in the year, and several more were built after that right into December -- all under the older 1974 emissions standards.

[studegary]

14 minutes ago, Skip Lackie said:

Our current concern with ID-ing the exact model year started when the first emissions and safety regs were issued in the mid-60s.  Although we usually think of them starting in a certain model year, the federal regs actually become effective on January 1 each year.  The car manufacturers don't want to change equipment every 1 January, so they adopt the standards early during model-year change-over.  I have a 74 Avanti that was built late in the year, and several more were built after that right into December -- all under the older 1974 emissions standards.

I agree.  I show 1974s as going to RQB 2175 (Skip's is RQB 2127).