Nelson

Black wrinkle finish.

Cut the hood brace for hose clearanc

Mike. Do you know what “A” number it might have been? If there was an A10 you would have to think there were at least nine others with the A prefix.

I always heard it was fitment problems but I seem to remember a few had it added in the backyard.

Probably disc brakes

Agree.

i remember when #9 was for sale in Texas for, I believe, $8k. A ton of money in the 70’s. I think that’s when Hora bought it. I know george Krem performed service on it in the Chicago Area at a Stude dealership where he was working. I think Vince said it was for sale at that time.

I guess the earlier numbers were taken. Most were assigned by the forth digit of their serial numbers. At least the V8 non Avanti cars.

Maybe sent to Paris?

I have seen one factory photo of an R4 engine compartment but don’t know where I saw it….probably the museum archives. Anyway, I was talking with George Krem about that photo and he had also seen it and in fact may have a copy. He is looking for it and will send a copy to me when and if he finds it. I’ll publish it here if it arrives. Are you certain it was one of the EX cars that got the R4 treatment? I speculated that it may have been 1016 since it had a R4 with the R3 setup when purchased from Paxton. Though it would make sense it was a South Bend engineering car.

Makes sense.

End toward the center?

Ed, I used to think the same thing. I was certain the car was red with a black interior. I was talking with George Krem day before yesterday at a car show in Az and road test car came up in the conversation. He mentioned the anticipated color in his mind was red/black. I think the black and white photos misled us and the fact that you would think the factory would have authorized a hot looking color like red not the conservative turquoise.

I’ll second that. On top of that he is an amazingly nice guy.

Geoff. I’m sure tracking down info on your dad’s car won’t be easy. I have a tendency to believe the 1/8 stroker story as it would improve sprint times but that also makes the story of 8000 rpm less plausible. In looking through the archives I looked at a lot of Avantis but 1025 was not one of them. The fact that it was Andy’s or Vince’s Avanti is in itself impressive. If I run across anything I will share it with you.

Well at least save the original block.

Brad. I will be interesting to see what if any differences exist.

The R4 is heavier by the weight difference in the pistons

Yes, late 259 pr 289 full flow block. But if your Hawk is a matching number R2 id look for a reputable shop that does this kind of work and have it repaired.

Mrs Granatelli, I believe it was Dolly, taking the Avanti to the grocery store was a tongue in cheek comment but I’m sure Vince or Andy did drive 1025 regularly. I don’t think 1016 was considered a daily driver. The tach on the steering column sounds right for 1025 as Paxton sold those iI guess but if you look at the photos at Riverside there is a factory 8k tach in the dash not on the column. Geoff, I’ve gone through every solid claim associated with 1025 as I wanted to be absolutely certain I was correct. Initially and very early on I thought the HRM and MT test car was 1016 based on a cursory look at it back in the 80’s. I commented on it back when 1025 started to make the claim to be the test car on this forum. The comments fell totally on deaf ears. I just let it go as I had no skin in the game and nothing to really go by other than my gut feel at he time. When I looked at 1016 in South Bend last year I bought the car five minutes after I looked under the hood. I’m no amateur when it comes to Paxton built cars and 1016 was obviously a Paxton built car. The car inspired a research project I hadn’t done in a long time. The fellow who bought 1025 actually guided me in the direction of the photo archives. He probably regrets that now and I feel bad about that but facts are facts and correct history is paramount. Even before the archives I could see a match up to the under hood scratches. I even looked at the orientation of the stripe on the heater hoses as 1016’s were still the originals. These even matches up to the test car. I just don’t understand how you can dispute what I’ve found as anything but concrete certainty. It isn’t here say it’s hard evidence and lots and lots of it.

i know you have had some of the preproduction prototypes in your shop. Do they have B numbers or EX numbers on the block? The B would probably be a Paxton designation and the EX a South Bend engineering designation. Another piece to the puzzle.

I’ve always wondered the significance of the A and B designation for the R3 and R4 engines. I’ve been thinking about this for years . I’ve asked the Granatellis with no luck at all. It dawned on me that the A engines were probably built in 1962 and probably were basically 299 engines with reworked standard cylinder heads. The B engines I originally thought were 304 with R3/4 cylinder heads until i found some B engines with 299 ci with the late cylinder heads. Then I remember the six cylinder Bonneville engines were also given B numbers. So my deduction would be all engines built in 1962 were simply A engines and are very few in number. All 1963 engines were B engines and so happened to have the new cylinder heads on the V8 and the six was assigned a B number because of the year. Paxton’s paperwork for expenditures were A for 1962 and B for 1963. This sounds reasonable to me. What do you think?

They probably recommend a position for the ends but the end result would be all the ends pointed toward or away from the c/l.

I didn’t notice the 1973. I’d have trouble talking about that except it probably had something to do with pollution control or safety?