Matching Number

[R2W55]

This has probably been discussed before but I could not find anything.

I am doing a frame off restoration of a 1978.  It has the original, but tired engine. I have the build sheet and engine number matches. It is a 350.

I have asked this question of some of the members in the Chicago chapter but I wanted to get a broader consensus.

How important is it to have matching numbers on an Avanti II?  I am waffling on having the engine rebuilt or putting in a crate engine. Cost is pretty much the same.

Do you think the car will have a greater value with the original engine or will not matter?  I am trying to keep the car as original as possible with as few modifications as needed.

Your opinion is appreciated.

[PackardV8]

No data to prove it either way, but you asked for opinions and I'd say it makes no difference in resale.  The 350" SBC, other than those in certain rare Corvettes, are considered 'belly-button' engines and one block is the same as another.

Also, you'll have a noticeable power and drivablilty increase if the carburetor and distributor are changed to performance models and compression increased to 9.5.  FWIW, we can usually provide a precision-machined long block for less than the big box catalog store craters.  If you have a few months this winter, we can quote a custom build of your core engine for less than crate cost.

jack vines

Edited August 21, 2018 by PackardV8

[mfg]

Many people do not care one way or another if an Avanti is equipped with its original engine or not.....they just hope to be getting a 'healthy' engine when buying the car.

It seems that a perspective buyer of a Studebaker Avanti would be more prone to look at the engine's serial number than the purchaser of a later Avanti ll. This, I believe, is because of the basic 'R' and 'RS' designations of the Studebaker Avanti engines.......With all of the parts swapping (and engine swapping) that has gone on over the years its important to know, for example, if an R1 engine with a supercharger added had the correct heads installed.

In my opinion (regarding resale value) it's not important an Avanti ll has its original factory installed Chevrolet engine.......However, it is nice to be able to read and understand the various Chevrolet engine 'codes' so one can determine exactly which type (cubic inch) of Chevy engine now resides under the hood!

Edited August 21, 2018 by mfg

[studegary]

For a 1978, I do not think that going either way will matter in my lifetime.   If your engine is rebuildable, I would probably just do that (consider Jack's offer).  For the lowest cost, you may be able to find a good running, low mileage 350 (getting more difficult all the time).     

[Gunslinger]

I agree with the others...it's not a big deal to the majority of Avanti people...particularly during the mid- to later 1970s which was the era of emissions choked engines.  If your engine is tired it's more cost effective to have Jack rebuild it or buy a crate engine set up the way that best suits your needs.  

[GlennW]

As above, for the same reasons. If cost is the biggest factor, you probably can't beat a rebuild of the current engine, and you know every hole will line up. If it's more about performance, there's so many hotter builds and you can always fog & save the original engine for "the next guy". If they want original, they can buy it, too.

[plwindish]

Randy, I've had the 400 in my 76 rebuilt twice so I've committed to keeping the engine (block, crank and oil pan) original. If I was doing it all over again, with reliability and power in mind, I'd most likely go for an LS swap.  The first rebuild, going 30 over saw new pistons, roller cam, lifters, head work, new aluminum intake and new carb.  That rebuild was just about dead even with what a crate motor install would have been in 2011.  The last rebuild was necessitated by a cracked head and required going another 10 over to clean up the cylinder wall damage in one cylinder.  The cracked head was discovered when converting the engine to a TBI EFI setup from MSD. This time, new pistons, rods, a more EFI friendly cam, aluminum heads, cast aluminum valve covers, ignition and spark box were added.  The motor is now putting out 471 hp and 560 pounds torque.  Its a screamer with the power and hopefully more reliable now as well, but the fact remains I could have had an LS swap done for considerably less than what was spent on the 2 rebuilds and the EFI.  I don't think we'll ever see originality being a premium in the Avantis made after 63, 64 and the 1st year II's made in 65/66.  A crate motor will definitely give your car a performance boost and most likely better fuel economy as well.  If you don't want to go the LS route with the more mods needed for install, go with a 383 crate and back it up with an automic overdrive trans for a nice street combination.  Changing the motor out will not hurt a II's value, putting in a new crate/ AOD combination will likely add value.

[Gunslinger]

With an LS engine there will be much less weight over the front end resulting in a much better balanced car and power-to-weight ratio will be better as well.  That's a much better way to go today.  The LS engine is an excellent power plant and if using the stock type intake and EFI will leave far greater room under the hood.  If only such an engine was available back when these cars were first made.

[R2W55]

Thanks for the replies.  I think I am convinced that I don't need matching numbers. I have been getting some good numbers on Crate Gen III engines.

My goal is still reliability over power but if can get both, why not?

Hopefully starting to put frame back together next week.  Control Arms have new bushings, they are powder coated and I have new springs.  Just need to get frame back from sandblaster and then KBS coat it.

Probably be a year before I need the engine.  Might as well wait until then as the new engine will have a warranty!

Great information again.

 

[Dan S]

Please keep us posted on your progress.  I'm not is need of any engine work on my '78 now, but I will in time.