Charging system

[Warner Vaughan]

I have a charging system mystery. When I start my 63 R-1 the ammeter indicates the battery is charging. As the car warms up the needle moves closer to zero. Once the car is running and completely warmed up the needle is in negative territory. If I turn on the headlights it drops to negative 15-20 amperes. If I drive 50 miles it will completely run down the battery, even without the headlights on. I have installed a new battery and voltage regulator. i had the alternator rebuilt. When I put a voltmeter on it it shows the alternator charging nicely. Two mechanics have told me everything is hooked up correctly. There is a small condenser tied into the voltage regulator that I don't see in the service or parts manuals. I don't know if that is important or not. Any ideas? 

Some have told me to bag it and put in a 60 amp one wire alternator. Is this a possibility? What model 60 amp alternator will fit an R-1?

[Avanti83]

Did you polarize the new voltage regulator after installation. Google/youtube will show you how if you didn't. Bob

[abasile]

That condenser is for radio static. What type of voltage

 regulator are you using? I would bet that is where the problem is coming from. 

Edited July 26, 2017 by abasile
typo

[Gunslinger]

If the car still has its original and correct alternator, it's a Prestolite 40-amp unit.  Other Studes of the time used a 35-amp alternator unless they had a R-series engine.  Because of that, they also used different voltage regulators.  It's possible you have a wrong alternator, wrong regulator or both.  

[Warner Vaughan]

On 7/25/2017 at 9:24 AM, Avanti83 said:

Did you polarize the new voltage regulator after installation. Google/youtube will show you how if you didn't. Bob

Thanks. I'll give it a try and let you know how it works.

[Warner Vaughan]

19 hours ago, abasile said:

That condenser is for radio static. What type of voltage

 regulator are you using? I would bet that is where the problem is coming from. 

Thanks for the reply.

The voltage regulator the one Studebaker Int'l sells for the car. Before spending $100+ for a new one I thought I would explore other options.

[Warner Vaughan]

16 hours ago, Gunslinger said:

If the car still has its original and correct alternator, it's a Prestolite 40-amp unit.  Other Studes of the time used a 35-amp alternator unless they had a R-series engine.  Because of that, they also used different voltage regulators.  It's possible you have a wrong alternator, wrong regulator or both.  

Thanks for the reply. 

The alternator is not original. I don't know what it is. It was rebuilt by Studebaker Int'l. The voltage regulator is the one Stude Int'l sells for the car. 

[StudeNorm]

I installed a 1-wire alternator that I was told was out of a Toyota.  The mounts are an exact match. I had to change the pulley and grind a very small portion of the casing so it would allow proper belt tension. It looks stock and I left the old regulator installed, but not functionally wired up. It has been working perfectly for the last 3 years, even when I have caused the battery to fully discharge and boosted the car to start it up.  The wiring looks a bit iffy but that is another project somewhere down the line.  Wiring looms are expensive and installing them is really time intensive.

 

 

Edited October 1, 2017 by StudeNorm
found better photos

[silverstude]

///// If I drive 50 miles it will completely run down the battery, even without the headlights on. ?////

If you're at speed and the thing isn't charging ( which is what you indicate), then I'd have a chat with the rebuilder..

edit#2

///// Two mechanics have told me everything is hooked up correctly. //////

Things can be hooked up correctly, but if they aren't working,   meh?

 

edit#3

Have you checked to see if the battery cables and clamps are in good shape?

Edited October 2, 2017 by silverstude

[Ron.Strasser]

Warner;

A few things.  First I don't understand the battery going close to dead in fifty miles.  I once ran my 6 volt Studebaker 150+ or so miles at night (head lights on everything else off) with a dead generator. Once I arrived home the head lights were about as bright as a candle.  Still the next morning the car started without a jump to go to the shop for a new generator.

To which terminal is the condenser connected to on the regulator.  I would disconnect it and see what happens. If it is connected to the field terminal on the regulator it is possible that it is causing a reduced voltage to be supplied to the alternator. Far fetched but possible.

What type of regulator is it.  The original style or a newer electronic regulator. If it is electronic; it is possible that heat is causing it to not work

Has the problem existed since replacing the alternator or did it exist previously?

Does the alternator and regulator look like the original?

Also a alternator can not be polarized; only a generator can.

On the original Prestolite alternator the output is controlled by supplying voltage to the field terminal. Connect 12 volts from the battery to the field terminal and the alternator should go to full output.  Disconnect the wire to the field terminal on the alternator first.

Ron

 

 

 

[Avantifan1]

Norm, I am in the midst of searching for that 1 wire alternator, the photo above, is it of your alternator? If I find one that fits and works I'll be sure to put the part number here.

[mfg]

Nice job on the Toyata install Studenorm!.....Those Toyota alternator numbers are as follows.........................

 

OEM..........02100-5410-31100-657-024

Auto Zone......14510 (35 Amp) or 14158 (50 Amp)

Car Quest (NAPA) 14184-35

I purchased the 50 Amp from Auto Zone as  a reasonably priced backup for my '63 Avanti, however, my Prestolite is still in good order so I haven't had to install it.

I'd guess Warner Vaughan charging issue is a bad alternator.

Edited February 23, 2019 by mfg

[Avantifan1]

Thanks MFG I appreciate the information.

[Avantifan1]

I just went to Auto Zone and looked at those part numbers and they both had the 3 wire plug on the back, I think the one I'm looking for is the single wire.

 

[StudeNorm]

I got my info from Bob Johnstone's Studebaker site. When I bought the alternator I went to an auto electrical store and simply asked for a 1985 Toyota single wire style and put my old alternator on the bench. The fellow took one look at it and said "don't go anywhere". He came back 2 minutes later and put the Toyota alternator on the bench beside my old one. The pulley was a bit different but otherwise they were pretty much identical. I paid about $85, took them both home, swapped pulleys and fitted it on the car. A very small amount of grinding was needed. Bob's instructions gave me a good idea of wiring and after studying the old wires I was able to make it operational using only one very short jumper and some creative splicing. See pics...

I am up in Canada's arctic right now or I would see if I could find any numbers on it for you. I return late Friday so if you can wait...

later

[mfg]

On 2/23/2019 at 8:30 PM, Avantifan1 said:

I just went to Auto Zone and looked at those part numbers and they both had the 3 wire plug on the back, I think the one I'm looking for is the single wire.

 

The 50 amp Toyota type alternator I purchased at Auto Zone has two terminals plus a ground wire connection (which uses one of the housing bolts)

The two main terminals are for power, (BAT), and field wires.

This alternator is externally regulated....Hope this helps!