Radio removal

[Mel]

My recently purchased '66 has had rather extensive 're-wiring' under the dash, including an aftermarket radio which has both front and rear outputs but only one set hooked up. I'd like to hook up the other set but I believe the wires are buried up under the indash speaker. I can't determine if the glove box comes out, whether the speaker comes out, or if I need to remove the dash.The car has A/C and removing the front panel from that gets me nowhere that I can see. I am considering removing the dash as there have obviously been some major shorts in the past but if I could get to everything without going that route, I may. I found a link under one of the forum questions in this section -- 'http://tinyurl.com/8fdyd' -- which supposedly told how to remove the radio but the article doesn't open. Any help will be greatly appreciated.

[Gunslinger]

You're definitely experiencing what many, if not most purchasers of older cars have to deal with...undoing what past owners have done before you can do it correctly.

There is no real way to get the radio out of an Avanti with a/c without pulling the dash...at least no way I've discovered. Maybe someone with tiny hands can get a lot of the effort done, but it's very difficult at best. The glove box doesn't come out...it's molded as part of the dash itself.

Pulling the dash, in concept and procedure anyway, is not a difficult job...but reality gets in the way of working in tight spaces in a 40+ year old car. That...plus the additions Avanti Motors did in adding certain items not in the original design such as driving lights switches, rear defogger switches, etc. Your car may or may not have these. Make sure you have a Studebaker shop manual...it gives step by step instructions.

If you do pull your dash, you can make life a bit easier by removing the steering wheel and the front seats...particularly the driver's seat. It makes for easier moving around on your back. Wrap the steering column with foam padding for its protection. Any wires you remove from gauges, lights, etc., carefully mark them so you can reconnect them correctly. While the dash is out, go ahead and replace every dash and gauge light bulb. They're inexpensive and most are likely old anyway. You don't want to go rooting around under and behind the dash any more than you have to later so take care of them now.

If at all possible when rewiring, use the same color and gauge wires for each application as original. That can save you a lot of grief down the road when needing to identify wires.

While the dash is out, go ahead and replace the front radio speaker...the one there is likely in sad shape from age and sun. Get a dual cone stereo front speaker from Studebaker International. If your car has the single rear speaker, Studebaker International also sells a stereo dual speaker for that as well. You always have the option of adding speakers to the doors as well as the rear package shelf if you care to cut holes for them.

Pulling the dash isn't a really bad job, you have to be careful and patient.

[adamderosa]

Try removing the front radio speaker (remove the four screws on the speaker grill and pry out the grill) - this gives you a nice access hole right above the radio. If you have a newer, smaller radio installed it can be removed through this opening. If not, you may be to at least see the wiring you're looking for and do your hook-ups from the top.

[Mel]

Gentlemen, Thanks for the ideas.

My speaker grill does not have the 4 screws up top and, although I can see the two screws on the left side of the speaker, I can't see or get to the other two so I think I'll probably pull the dash.

I have a 63-64 shop manual and Stan Gundry's manual and, although a lengthy procedure, removing the dash doesn't look too difficult. Any idea of how long a first-timer would require?

The idea about bulb replacement was a good one. I'd thought about removing the steering wheel, also. Will a standard gear puller work? Does the lever on the signal light switch come off easily? I'd probably remove it to keep from breaking it. I think I'll replace the heater, defroster and A/C ductwork also. Thanks for the tip about using the same color and gauge wiring.

Any other tips will be appreciated. Thanks again.

[Gunslinger]

A standard steering wheel puller will work. A gear puller is a different tool. The correct puller is not very expensive at Pep Boys, Auto Zone, Advance Auto or other store. Some stores will even loan them out for free.

Plan on a long afternoon to do it, but as straight forward a procedure as it is, plan on it being a pain in the rear. I'd leave the turn signal stalk on...don't remove any more parts than you have to...don't tempt fate.

Another hint...get a magnet made for magnetizing tools. Magnetize the socket you use to remove the four hold down nuts for the dash...they're real easy to lose if they drop. Even if they aren't lost, it can save time searching for them. Don't ask how I know all this!

Replacing all the ductwork is a good idea. While you're back there, take a good look at everything and fix or replace anything that needs it while you're there anyway. It can save some grief later. Lubricate anything that's movable...like vent cables, etc.

As I said earlier...it's not a tough procedure, but you have to be careful and patient. It's really easy to get frustrated if things don't go so easy.

[Mel]

Thanks for all the tips; the magnetized tool is a good one. Gundry's book notes one of the 'shorts waiting to happen' is the steel plate behind the ignition switch rubbing the center post on the switch. It looks like about a half inch or so of that steel plate could be ground down to reduce that threat. Any experience with this? Thanks again.

[WayneC]

Here's a wild thought... if you could find a replacement speaker grill, you could consider destroying the original in an effort to remove it... start with the two screws you can reach, see if removing them gives you any wiggle-room to loosen the other two, or cut the center out of the grill to get at the second pair of screws; if you have to destroy the old grill, devise a way to remount the new one without using screws (silicone caulk, for example, or wire push-in clips, or those universal plastic fasteners used for door panels, etc that you can buy at the local parts store and which simply push in and grasp the hole).

I've only removed the radio on cars with the grill screws, and that was long ago. IIRC, I removed the original huge Stude AM radio (in a '66 Avanti, I think) by removing the grill and slightly enlarging the dash grill opening, barely enough to wriggle the radio out, yet not removing

any material that could be seen after the grill was in place... not easy, but do-able; the smaller replacement stereo was an easy install.

And, are you certain there ARE 4 screws in the speaker grill? It's possible there are tabs or some other method of attachment, such that the grill is slid into place on one end, then nuts used to secure the screws on the other end.

Edited October 26, 2008 by WayneC

[Gunslinger]

Early Avanti radios...Studebaker and apparently some early Avanti II's, have speaker grilles that are attached from underneath. The grilles (at least my old '63 R1), had threaded bolts fitted to the lower side of the grille. They fit through holes in the dash and nuts attached from underneath. A nice looking installation but not practical as far as later servicing goes. Possibly why it was changed later. Later cars have clips attached to the mounting holes for the screws to thread through for topside replacement.

Changing a radio is an Avanti...particularly an a/c equipped car, is a nasty job. Radios in most contemporary cars were tough to remove as well, but I don't believe many had to have the dash removed to do so.

[abasile]

You can get the radio out of your Avanti by getting those four nuts off of the speakers first. You need to feel your way to do it, but it can be done. As described earlier once your have the nuts off you can push the metal grill up and then get the speaker out through the hole. The trouble is once you do this and then pull the radio our there is no way to get the speaker to stay in once you have fixed or replaced the radio. I handled it a different way in my 1968. I mounted a new radio/cd player in my glove box. You don't have to screw it down as a piece of foam will keep it in place. I then mounted the face plate from my old Avanti radio back in the stock opening. You have to glue the dial and knobs to the old face plate, but it does look like the stock radio with the factory illumination and all. Since the radio is now gone, you can mount a stereo speaker in the stock grill opening with plenty of room for your hands to secure the stock grill. Since my car already had speakers in the doors from a previous owner, I hooked those up to the system as well. It may sounds a little wacky -- but it can be done and it sounds great.

[theGman]

Previous owner in my '81 installed a DIN size radio. I upgraded it with the same size (into the same case) and added a better touch by custom grinding/filing a faceplate to perfectly follow the contours of the dash radio opening.

I know this is not the best way, but it sure makes for a wide selection.

Anyway, I'm sure this has been considered by now.

The main advantage to the '81 is that the radio speaker grill is replaced with the little storage niche which drops into the same space.

Paul