[Avanti 63R-1025]

i received a huge packet of information from Nostalgic Motors over the weekend. Included was the factory manifest, 14 pages of factory inspection tickets, and the factory to dealer invoice. The top line of the factory to dealer invoice was originally for $500 which was crossed out and replaced with the normal vehicle price hand written. There were then multiple lines of other charges, a large credit, and a final price of $500 for the sale to Paxton Products.

[Remove 71 Avanti shims and mount body to chassis like 63]

Does anyone know what issues may be presented if the shims that changer the body stance on the chassis for Avanti II's from the 63-64's are removed? I will have to re-radius the front fenders but prefer the original look.

The engine is not currently in the car so I cannot check engine - hood clearance.

[Avanti 63R-1025]

I just purchased a 71 RB-Q1703. Will transfer a few parts to 63R-1025 to get it back on the road again.

Talked to brother Doug last night about the engine when it was torn down years ago. We never suspected that the stroke had been altered, all of the 299's were 60 over 289's, or R3-A versions, vs the later "B" serial numbers. By using a R2 with factory service parts and allowable modifications to the R2 heads and manifolds a "production" R3 could be entered into competition before enough "B" version 304.5 engines could be produced to become "production" As it is, there were never enough produced to b considered a "Production" car for most sanctioning bodies. Back to the tear-down. Doug noted that he had never seen a crank that had had so much attention to detail and polishing, and that the rods also looked different. No measurments were taken, we were just replacing some seals and cleaning for show.

The last discussion with Andy suggested that in order to get a little more torque to do better at drag racing they assumed that since 299" Avanti's were recognized as production engines that if they slipped in a stroked 299 instead of a bored 299 that they might get away with it. It worked and for awhile 63R-1025 held the 1/2 mile drag record at Riverside beating all including Hemi's. As the 1/2 mile drags were ended shortly thereafter it may still hold the record. I have tried to get a copy but the track is closed and requests for informaiton have not yet yeilded any information. Vince said that this was the fasted accellerating Avanti and was given to magazines for R3 road tests for that reason. Apparanly this was the only stroked engine. It was not a production part and if discoverd that this was a stroked 299 and ot a 60 over 289 it would not have been considered a "production" Avanti.

Since it was first sold by Studebaker to Vince in 1965 with the modified engine installed by Studebaker, I would assert that it is a very unique "Production" R3, as were the few others used at Bonneyville and later sold by Studebaker. That would create a slightly longer list of factory "R3's" including the few 60 over "A" engines and the one stroked engine. The "A" engines were recognized by sanctioning bodies as allowable production engine modifications, there were not enough "B" engines to allow them to meet most sanctioning body requirements for 'production' status. 63R-1025 is unique because it is a one-off that would be very hard to qualify as a production engine if torn down for inspection.

Per Vince Granetelli, "an R3 is anything that we say is an R3. We engineered it, built it, and very few were identical"

An interesting observation regarding the engine, the valve retainers are a very light alloy and each one is a unique part obviously made one at a time by hand on a lathe and retain 3 coils, the center coil wrapped the opposite of the inner and outer springs.

[Wanted: Build sheet for 1971 Avanti II, RQB 1600]

Boogieman,

Would love a copy of the 71 price guide if you still have it. I just brought home RB-Q1703 last Saturday to keep 63R-1025 company.

[Trivia! 299 CI R3 Manifold]

I had a couple of 2x4bbl 289's that used Cadillac manifolds. They lined up with remarkablly little work. Early manifolds used the Carter WCFB 4bbl carbs, and later manifolds used Carter AFB's as used on the R4's. I had one of each.

[Avanti 63R-1025]

Somewhere I have the original bill of sale from Vince. The car was sold by him as an R3 to a Southern California aerospace engineer who had it for a short time. He and may other aerospace engineers lost his job an he moved from the LA area to the SF East Bay and he put the car up for sale. I purchased it using the Hot Rod magazine as my only referance as to it being an R3.

A couple of years later my brother Doug got hold of Vince and Vince confirmed that it was the first prototype, a test mule, and the Hot Rod Magazine R3 test car.

Regading a question of celebrity ownership, I was told by both Vince and Andy the car was originally used by Sherwood Egbert and the AM/FM radio was installed at his request, but he had it only for a short time as Andy and his brother Joe went to South Bend and picked up 1025 and another. The other was dropped off with family and 1025 driven to LA. Andy spoke quite a bit about how the family member painted the other a terrible shade of metalic green.

MFG seems to have a lot of the same information that I have about 1025 being a test mule. It had it's front motor mounts modified to get the engine to sit lower in the chassis to get hood clearance. The early hoods had a reinforcement that had to be cut to get the blower hose to the R3 air box. The car had air cleaner installed in front of the radiator with the hose routed throught the fender well to reach it. It had a custom built exhaust balance pipe installed between the left and right exhause ahead of the muffelers, a feature of the quiet tone exhause option offered later, it was cut/welded, not clamped. There was a damage repair to the left rear quarter panel due to damage when Vince blew a tire at speed, I uderstand the rear window simultaneosly blew. I used to know all the rear window attach designs. This being among the first 86 cars that had design #1 replaced immediately it should have had design #2, instead it was either #3 or #4.

I also understood the first 86 cars had terrible body fit. 1025 certainly did, you could grab the drivers door at the bottom when closed because the rocker panel was indented enough to do so, and there was a sag in the roof deep enough for water to pool. It took a lot of work to get the body closer to the quality of the later cars.

Re the engine; the heads show a tremendous amount of work, the combustion chamber is more domed and does not have the abrupt separator between intake and exhaust like stock heads, both intake and exhause chambers are very smooth with much more flowing walls. The valve retainers are very light and might be titanium. There were dual valve springs with a 3rd coiled in the reverse direction between them. Every retainer is slightly different, obvously individually created on a lathe. The heads have been off a couple of times, and one of those times I checked the bore and it was still a stock 289 bore.

Comments about the rear axle; wish it had flanged shafts like the prodfuction R3's, My brothers and I have owned at least 14 Studebakers, mostly Hawks and Avanti's. I have had several axles break at the keyway in Hawks, and although I have every axle magnafluxed any time one is removed, one broke in 1025. I have had it happen often enough that I learned a teltale creak and as soon as i heard it pulled over and called for a tow truck. He grumbled that the car was fine but I had it towed home. As he dropped it and I put a stand under the axle, I then grabbed the tire and the tire/wheel/break drum fell to the ground! The twin traction clutches and plates were installed so that there was more friction area, don't remember if it was x2 or x4, but it was impossible to even paralell park without the rear axle locking. As any amount of torque would lock it, lifting your foot in a corner could be very exciting, and is probably the reason that the cars last trip was through a farmers fence.

Regarding the production order; never seen it but would be interesting to see. My understanding is that the car was first used by Sherwood Egbert and that he had requested that it have the AM/FM radio. He had it a very short time and it and another Avanti were picked up by Andy and Joe Granatelli. One was dropped of to family in Chicago, and the other driven to LA. The car had California MFG plates until sold by Studebaker to Vince in 1965.

Regarding "factory R3". There are only the 9 documented factory R3's, and I don't know if any of them were ever raced by the factory. To my knowledge those 9 were pretty mucy identically engineered. I have seen a couple of them and as I recall they did not have the Paxton instruments installed under the radio. Mine has a Paxton superchager pressure and fuel pressure gage to monitor that the blower never has more pressure than the fuel pump. Were that to happen the engine would lean out and likely burn the valves. I have also seen a triple instrument cluster but don't recall what the 3rd instrument was for. There were a number of prototype R3's, a even more Paxton installed R3 transplants. Many if not most had significant differences from the ones installed at the factory. I never spoke to Joe, but perhaps the best definition of an R3 was the one given by both Andy and Vince when I asked; "If it came from Paxton and we called it an R3, it's and R3"

Hopefully Geoff and I make some progress this year getting it back together. Mechanically it's fine, just old like I have become, but that farmers barbed wire fence did not do the body any favors! I'd love to take it to one more event.

[Avanti 63R-1025]

I finally had time to read the entire thread.

[Avanti 63R-1025]

I just stumbled onto this forum following a link from my son.

63R1025 is parked in a hanger on my farm in Southern Maine. Hauled it here from the San Francisco area in 2001, purchased it in late 60's, probably 69. I took the Hot Rod magazine R3 road test issue with me. The motor looked identical. I found out later that it was the car used for the article. I purchased the car for $2750 and with it came the bill of sale from Vince Granatelli and California Registration for a 1965 2 door Studebaker. Vince purchased the car from Studebaker during final asset liquidation, prior it had California MFG plates. My brother Doug and I have been in contact with Vince off and on since the 70's, and I received a call from Andy not too long before his passing.

63R1025 (RS1021) has a lot of history and was pretty unique. Vince was the first owner, but Andy considered it "his" Avanti until work with Studebaker finished and all the toys were liquidated.

I'll read through this post and add comments and reply to questions in the next few days, however; an early comment after reading the first couple of posts regarding horespower ratings is that after Andy told me he ran the engine to 8,000rpm and after I got back up off the floor, I asked him how many horsepower the car made at that RPM. He said thy never put it on a Dyno, that the Board of Directors was not to supportive of the performance initiatives so they did not advertise horsepower, and that all of the figures "leaked" out were taken at low (5,000) RPM readings to keep the Board from getting too uneasy, however; to beat a Hemi he figured that it would have had to peak at about 500.