mfg Posted April 7, 2014 Report Share Posted April 7, 2014 I faithfully continue to add one pint of STP at every oil change in my cars with Studebaker engines. I wondered if most all Stude owners still do that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigdaddy Posted April 8, 2014 Report Share Posted April 8, 2014 (edited) Sure! Especially with the lack of Zink additives in todays oil, we need all the help we can get. Besides, if it was good enough for Andy Granatelli, it's good enough for me. Edited April 8, 2014 by bigdaddy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PackardV8 Posted April 8, 2014 Report Share Posted April 8, 2014 Your opinions and results may vary. After conversations with a friend who's been a petroleum engineer for forty years, I don't add anything to oil or gasoline. He told me essentially, they're all snake oil. If the STP, Marvel Mystery Oil, Wynns, Sea Foam, et al, were any good, it would be much less expensive to add them to all the oil/gas. He also said the manufacturers of the additives buy their stock from the refiners and sometimes just package it in smaller cans. jack vines Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest dapy Posted April 8, 2014 Report Share Posted April 8, 2014 Snake oil I get. Quality differences with basic engine oil as reflected by price I don't get. Are they graded beyond viscosity and synthetic and mineral oil? All out of the same barrel? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StudeNorm Posted April 16, 2014 Report Share Posted April 16, 2014 I was reading issue 144 of the AOAI magazine last night and the article regarding STP gave the reason it is required. It has the lubricants (mostly zinc) necessary to keep the flat tappet cam followers from wearing out the cam lobes. Zinc is needed in older cars when oils that don't have ZDDP in them are used. Some Diesel, racing and specialty oils still have a high enough level of zinc to provide lubrication but most modern car oils do not. STP contains zinc. Modern car engines do not require the same level of zinc as they use roller style cam followers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PackardV8 Posted April 16, 2014 Report Share Posted April 16, 2014 Can you provide a reference stating the amount of zinc and or ZDDP currently used in STP, diesel, racing oils available for retail sale? jack vines Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunslinger Posted April 16, 2014 Report Share Posted April 16, 2014 If you ask the people at STP what the amount of ZDDP is in their product, they'll simply say "sufficient". They won't disclose the amount which doesn't count for much the way I look at it. Even some of the motor oils that have kept ZDDP in their formulas have lowered the amounts in the last few years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PackardV8 Posted April 16, 2014 Report Share Posted April 16, 2014 Agree; it's like the scammer selling "real tetraethyl lead additive" but he won't disclose the concentration. That's because real tetraethyl lead is both a deadly poison and illegal to sell for use in street driven motor vehicles. He gets away with it because he's peddling snake oil, not real lead. jack vines Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaffeineRacer Posted April 18, 2014 Report Share Posted April 18, 2014 Not to get too off topic from Oil, but I add sea foam to my cars and motorcycle gas tank every once and a while. In my 2002 V6 ford explorer at least I've seen consistently about a 7.2 mpg increase with highway driving and a less substantial 4 mpg increase city. Which is awesome because my explorer gets crazy shitty mileage, but when I calculated it out it's still more expensive to add the sea foam every time I fill up than to simply deal with the usual crummy mileage. As for oil I've used the expensive joe Gibbs stuff in my Avanti with the flat tapper 305 and Rotella T3 in my motorcycle with much luck. I'm thinking about using the Rotella in the avanti next time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfg Posted April 18, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 18, 2014 I've been using 15-40W Rotella (diesel rated) in my R2 for several years now. (in summer) The engine seems to be happy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Kile Posted April 19, 2014 Report Share Posted April 19, 2014 I'm using Castrol Edge 5w-50 in all my vehicles. 68 E-TYPE, 84 Avanti with stage two Jasper 350, Pontiac Vibe, 2008 FX-DB Harley, Airplane, and Lawn mower. Happy with it. CharlieRQB3921 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest dapy Posted April 21, 2014 Report Share Posted April 21, 2014 (edited) Airplane? Continental or Lycoming engine? Shame on you. That could void a warranty. I asked about the relationship between (presumed) quality and oil price. So far all I have is opinion. Personally I like the purple oil. When it leaks on the garage floor you know that it engine oil. Edited April 21, 2014 by dapy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Kile Posted April 21, 2014 Report Share Posted April 21, 2014 I'm using it in a Lycoming 0-235C2C. In a Yankee AA1. Using Aeroshell 15-50 it would run hot in any weather and in the summer it ran over red line. I switched to Castrol Synthetic 5w-50 now it never gets out of the green, has better oil pressure, uses less oil, and starts a lot better in the cold. Product liability problems, and certification costs prevents the aviation industry moving into the twentieth century much less the twenty first. Charlie RQB3921 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigdaddy Posted April 24, 2014 Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 (edited) About 2 years ago, 2 of my sons rebuilt engines in there muscle cars, (GM). One is a 427 sbc, the other is a 496bbc. . After using the proper assembly lube and following the proper break in procedure, both cams wiped out on breakin. After contacting the cam companies they were told to use Rotella T oil for the break in procedure, because of the lack of ZDDP in popular oils. Both engines were disassembled and cams replaced. They used Rotella T on breakin and everything was fine. Too bad, it wasn't stated in their breakin procedure at the time, could be by now. Is this a fluke or not? Both engines have high valve spring tension, although inner springs were removed during breakin, per cam breakin procedure. Edited April 26, 2014 by bigdaddy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunslinger Posted April 24, 2014 Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 There was an article a couple of years back in a car magazine regarding the cam wiping issues. There was a lot of finger pointing and myths surrounding the issue at the time. It turned out to be a "perfect storm" of events at the same time that made things happen as they did. At about the same time as the EPA began mandating reduced ZDDP in motor oils due to its negative effects on catalytic converters, a lot of camshaft companies were buying what turned out to be substandard camshaft blanks and lifters from offshore. Since ZDDP acted as a buffer more or less between cam lobes and lifters and was suddenly reduced or eliminated in many oils added to high valve spring pressures in performance engines, cams were being wiped during break-in. After enough investigation was performed the truth came out, though many myths and other inaccurate "facts" are still prevalent. Ultimately, better quality control in manufacture of camshafts and lifters, along with better assembly and break-in procedures have pretty much eliminated the problem. Still...the problem was generally confined to high-compression, high-performance engines with high valve spring pressures. It's generally during break-in, when wear is highest, that a failure will occur. I feel that some who blame the lack of ZDDP on the failure of their high-mileage engines are simply finding someone else to hold responsible for their lack of maintenance or simply a worn-out engine. It's like when lead was removed from automotive fuels and there were dire predictions of valve failures. While some did occur...it was likely due to high mileage engines already in need of overhaul or lack of servicing. There are still millions of older engines without hardened valve seats still humming along on unleaded fuel. Bigdaddy...you said your sons followed procedures on rebuilding the engines...that takes the responsibility off of them. Yes...the cam makers should have specified the appropriate motor oils for break-in...if to relieve themselves of liability if no other reason. They need to be protective of their reputation as well. Having their cams get wiped during break-in...regardless of cause...does them no good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avanti83 Posted April 24, 2014 Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 I installed a Lunati hydraulic lifter cam in my SBC 383 last fall and the instructions were very specific about using the Lunati breakin additive in the oil for break in. In fact, I can't remember the last cam I put in that didn't have instructions to use break in additive. Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigdaddy Posted April 26, 2014 Report Share Posted April 26, 2014 I should have pointed out that additive was used on both engines, but as "Gunslinger" pointed out, most of these failures were on high compression, high valve spring pressure engines. Both engines are. They don't run on pump gas! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfg Posted April 26, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 26, 2014 About 2 years ago, 2 of my sons rebuilt engines in there muscle cars, (GM). One is a 427 sbc, the other is a 496bbc. . After using the proper assembly lube and following the proper break in procedure, both cams wiped out on breakin. After contacting the cam companies they were told to use Rotella T oil for the break in procedure, because of the lack of ZDDP in popular oils. Both engines were disassembled and cams replaced. They used Rotella T on breakin and everything was fine. Too bad, it wasn't stated in their breakin procedure at the time, could be by now. Is this a fluke or not? Both engines have high valve spring tension, although inner springs were removed during breakin, per cam breakin procedure. Did they continue to use the Rotella oil after the break in periods? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigdaddy Posted April 26, 2014 Report Share Posted April 26, 2014 No. Just during breakin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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