GlennW
-
Posts
185 -
Joined
-
Last visited
Content Type
Profiles
Forums
Events
Posts posted by GlennW
-
-
I think the major one is the "but they kept making them in Canada, right?". That is easy to see as some of the passenger car line WAS still made for a bit in Canada and cars with Avanti in their name were made long after 1963. Then there's the confusing lineage after the original Stude ones, where we have some Stude frames w/non-Stude engines and then whole running chassis of various other brands with Avanti-ish bodies atop. I'd have to look up a bunch of different answers based on what I was asked, so I can't make fun of "newbies". I had to eat crow once after "correcting" yet another person saying his buddy owned one with a Ford engine in it. Since Ford also had a 289 V8 there have always been folks who just assumed it was a Ford. In this case I forgot about the Mustang-based later cars.
-
I don't recall anyone questioning your work, or am I reading something wrong? Obviously some info from one who's already been doing it would be great if you'd like to share with us or at least the original poster. Thanks for the SMC info, due to the higher cost of SMC tooling I always thought Avanti panels would have been RTM or even LRTM considering the rush to production. Some of the body shapes don't seem to lend themselves to SMC pressing, like the front ridges where the fender rolls down to the bumper.
-
Thanks...............I learned somehing from this.
Merry Christmas!
John
My pleasure, Merry Christmas to you also. The screws/wellnuts that came with my SI repop mirror are 10-32 thread, I don't have any 10-32 rivnuts handy to measure but a 10-24 rivnut is smaller diameter than the 10-24 wellnut. Assuming the same applies for 10-32 Rivnuts I'm going to go with them and see how I like the installation (assuming the fiberglass doesn't exceed the rivnut's .130"~.225" grip range) since if it doesn't work I can just open up the holes to the correct wellnut size.
-
My pleasure, would love to know if there's some "new" super dooper bonding agent or whatever for repairs . My fairings may be new but my Avanti sure isn't
-
One other thing to keep in mind. E85 doesn't always have 85% Ethanol. Your only assurance is that it will be no more than 85% Ethanol. With Flex-Fuel vehicles, this isn't important as the engine's managaement system is able to adjust to obtain stoichrometric balance but with a carburetor, you have not the ability to adjust jet sizes "on the run".
Good point on not knowing what % E85 could be vs the obvious 85%. My 2013 E350 van is FlexFuel and only once have I used the E85. That was when I was in the middle of nowhere and running low on fuel, and came across a one-station town that had only E85 because of a underground tank contamination problem. Rather than gamle on the next town I just filled 'er up and drove off. Figure I had maybe a 75% mixture with that top off and when I filled up later on with "real gas"
it may have made it more like a 20%-30% mixture. The thing is, the van doesn't care since it's a closed-loop system with an ECU vs a Carter AFB. -
I seriously doubt the Avanti body was layed up using epoxy..but if im wrong tell me where i can get the specs.....thanks ....BILL
Best bet IMHO is find a shop that specializes in early Corvette repair or 60's-70's classic fiberglass boats and see if they'll work with you. Fiberglass loses esters (dries out) over time and adhesion with new glass is always a problem. Since I deal with fairly green glass I don't have any expertise with repairing old stuff. I can get away with roughing something up and scrubbing with acetone & a 3M pad and once it's dry I'm good to go. FWIW I don't know when the Vinyl Ester resins came into production use. Polyester General Purpose (GP) was used extensively in boats in the 60's. Vinyl Esters are stronger and more durable than Polyester, but not as much as the Epoxy resins. The Vinyl can use the same common glass cloth as Polyester and both work well at room temperature. The biggest advantage in addition to knowing what works & doesn't, they may save you big bucks on materials in small qtys. Resins that run around $10 or less per pound in a 55 gal drum or larger qtys. can easily go $20-$30 per quart in that size. Then there's making sure you have the correct mekP for the resin selected and avoiding hazardous shipping fees for buying it online. Likewise, if you're not going to need an 80 pound roll of fabric...
-
I've used Rivnuts and like them a lot. I used them on the panel between the rear seat back cushion and the gas tank. If, you have ever removed that panel, you know there are a lot of screws securing it in place. My experience in that installation was that the majority of the Rivnuts would "bite" the fiberglass correctly, but every now and then they would not and the Rivnit would spin. Could it be operator error? Without a doubt. Drilling out the spinning Rivnut creates a "SloppyHole" in the glass , making the installation of a same size replacement questionable. Going up in Rivnut size means larger screw as well. On the panel at the gas tank, ( larger size ) no problem. On a mirror ( larger size ) ............problem.
I've used Rivnuts on metal applications as well with no problems. Like I said, I've used them a lot on my other cars.
Agreed, unless one can hold a Rivnut from the swaged side with a visegrip while drilling, they are a problem to get out and can spin & leave the hole oversized. Since the Rivnuts need a snug fit to be set correctly that can be a killer BUT there are often different OD rivnuts for the same size thread. I make fiberglass motorcycle fairings that use six ¼-20 and four 10-24 aluminum Rivnuts so I've set a lot of them. The smooth shank with knurled head ¼-20 ones I normally use take a size Q drill. If anything goes wrong there is another part number for a grooved shank that takes a 25/64" drill. After I set them in fairings halves I use low-foaming Elmer's Glue-All Max (similar to Gorilla Glue) overnight to help add rigidity & combat spinning. In a blind use like the Avanti mirrors I would only use a grooved shank aluminum one and make darn sure it was the proper grip range for the fiberglass thickness. (it's 28° in the garage right now, so I'd also do it months from now)
-
Like the name of the swing shift gate guard in September 1954?
Dennis
That would be Burt, except for when he took a vacation or sick day and Phyllis took his shift
-
I've always found the best way to keep an online forum healthy is snip and snipe at each other whenever possible........NOT
If the Trivia section was a popup that couldn't be avoided by simply not clicking on it... ☺
-
I'm curious why nobody uses Rivnuts as the body anchors. Perhaps it's because they want the mirrors to be able to move around a bit if jostled and bumped by pedestrians in parking lots & garages? I've never cared for how much movement the mirror assy has, always made them feel cheap. The washer shimming makes sense, but the wellnuts are still rubber, right?
-
Outside rear view mirrors were dealer installed. In '63 the fenders were generally the location they were installed. For '64 models the sides of the doors became the preferred location. You have to remember that many states at that time didn't require outside rear view mirrors so it was left up to dealers.
There's supposed to be well nuts on the inside of the door used with special screws to secure the mirrors...not simply the screws themselves holding the mirrors to the fiberglass. When you simply use screws through the fiberglass there's really nothing much to keep the mirrors from moving and weakening the holes. Yours look like it had increasingly larger screws used in an attempt to secure the mirrors.
The well nuts and special screws are available from Studebaker International and likely the other normal vendors.
So the location of the right door holes in his second pic would (could) be considerd correct for adding to a '64 that already has it's left one up on the fender like the first picture's? My '64 has had it's left hand one on the front fender from day one, and never had a right hand. Haven't gotten around to adding a right hand one yet, though last Fall I finally bought one
-
Very interesting.
In a side note, couldn't help but notice the 4WD Pinto in the background.
See, all Ford had to do to make 'em safe was get the gas tank up in the air where it didn't line up with other vehicles
-
Yes, in hindsight it's a bit surprising that the T-86 three speed, with it's non-syncro first gear, was even offered by Studebaker for the Avanti!
True, 'course in general, I don't understand why the "start in 2nd AT was the one offered either. The car certainly weighs enough that even in general driving it really benefits from a first gear standing start. My guess is it's pure gimmick-designed to make folks feel cool shifting their AT-equipped car 'cause "they're supposed to". If it weren't for the cost and general hassle I'd have tossed in a "normal" BW in my R1 long ago.
-
One thing both cars share is that for those buyers who DID want a manual transmission, most paid extra for a 4-speed over the base 3-speed. A no brainer to me, also.
-
Corvettes through 1969 had the 3-speed manual as a base transmission...4-speeds were an extra cost option as with the Avanti as built by Studebaker. Corvettes also had the 2-speed Powerglide as the only automatic available through 1967 and only with the lesser horsepower engines.
Convertibles were more popular than coupes until the C3 generation with lift-off hatches were made standard. While the split window '63 was later considered very desirable it wasn't at the time...convertibles outsold it and it was deleted after one year. There were even kits made to eliminate it and replace it with the one-piece back glass for those who didn't like the obstructed rear view.
Thanks GS, I've (hopefully) edited my mistakes in the previous quoted post. Could've sworn it was a 3-Speed AT, but looking back, that's the same 2-speed my Buick had. Maybe the 3-Speed Automatic was in the 1965 Studebaker-powered Canadian 'vettes.
Not the kind of data I'd want to depend on, but it seems the Corvette buyer had a different concept in mind than the average Avanti buyer, HP over an AT and far less interest in AC than the Avanti buyer.
-
I have some stats on the 1963 Corvette to compare with, undoubtably a sports car in direct competition for sales with the Avanti and at a similar price point. There were about 21,000 '63 'vettes sold, with a choice of optional (4-speed) Manual or Automatic Transmission. The build info shows a whopping 85% were built with the optional 4-speed manual trans, another 4½% with the std 3-Speed manual and 12½% with the optional Automatic I have no idea if fact that roughly half the '63 Corrvette cars built were convertibles means squat or if the '63-'64 Avati number would have been different if 20,000 of them had been sold from a readly available pool of cars of most build combinations available. FWIW only 1¼% of all '63s had AC.
-
According to the Avanti Production data compendium available from the SNM, there were a total of 3354 Studebaker Avantis equipped with automatic transmissions and 1211 equipped with a 4-speed. Out of all Studebaker production of the Avanti, about 72% were automatics and 26% were 4-speed equipped (the small balance were base 3-speeds). So roughly a quarter of Avanti production were 4-speed cars.
As far as a/c equipped cars, a total of 1096 left South Bend with a/c...or about 23% of total Avanti production and 32% of all R1's came with a/c.
Actually...I would have thought the number of a/c equipped Avantis to have been higher..
Thanks for taking the time to get that info. I wish I knew what the industry average was for AC overall in the early 60's, as I haven't a clue how the Avanti might measure up to any baseline. The 32% for the R1 might actually be a high number for a non-Caddilac/Lincoln type car. Since you couldn't get AC on an R2 perhaps that is some kind of indication of how people chose what was most important? With such a small sample group and not even knowing how many Avantis went to areas where AC wasn't really needed vs southern climes, it may not mean anything provable.
-
The exact numbers have been compiled and are available through the Studebaker National Museum. I have the information but am not near it at the moment. It will probably be a day before I can refer to it, but I will do so unless someone else does before I can.
Sweet, thanks. No rush of course, not as if anybody's car is going to run better or worse because of it. I'm not even sure if it will be useful, but this seems to be a thread that's garnered some interest and lively conversation.
-
Good thought, but I believe that using two flex plates may lead to other problems....No, there was another very permanent solution...Anyone?
Not saying it's right to do so but I DO remember reading somewhere way back when, that you could install two flex plates and then not use the reinforcement ring.
-
If 90% were ordered with AT, anybody know what % had AC? Just curious if that ties in somehow or is meaningless because '63 a LOT of cars were ordered without air conditioning. Even that 401-equipped '63 LeSabre wagon I mentioned didn't have it and it had the upgraded interior and rear-facing 3rd seat, hardly ordered as a sports car
-
FWIW, got the new pump from SI today and the vane depth is .940" and the pulley mounting face dimension is within .015" of the old one. I'm not going to touch a thing. I'll put the pump on by itself and give it a spin, .940" is less than the one that came out so it all should be golden.
-
Just trying to be sure, even with emoticons its hard to always be sure how what one writes is coming across, and a lot of people confuse, "doesn't understand" with "doesn't agree". In a thread like this, I suppose the big thing is having a consensus on what the word, "performance" even means. Going fast in a straight line is a good measure for some, snaking through a set of twistys might be a requirement for others. You bring up a good point with, "Paxton Superchargers vs. air conditioning" since with some of Avantis competition (Riviera comes to mind) you didn't have to choose between HP or AC. I have never driven a '63 Riviera so I have no idea if it is better or worse on a road course. That said, I have no doubt with the same amount of effort the Granatellis could've exceeded any speeds the Avanti ran through traps or ¼miles and I don't know that the public really followed details like what class(es) the cars might have been in. Ad agencies will pitch anything, regardless of what the engineers might have wanted to say. I remember AMC selling the Pacer as the, "small car with the big car ride" when in reality it was more like, "the small car with the big car appetite for gas"
-
If that was the case, it appears that Studebaker and the brothers Granitelli spent a lot of time, effort, and money on the salt flats just for grins. No telling why Studebaker printed up all those showroom banners listing the records that were broken if the intended Avanti buyer just wanted a country club cruiser. More likely, Studebaker wanted a performance car in the GT style that could meet a range of buyer expectations. Automatics vs. four speeds, Paxton Superchargers vs. air conditioning. Not a lot of options to choose from back then.
Dennis
R2470
R2 4-speed
Understood, and hope you don't take it personal because I love the Avanti, too. I think part of the Granitellis' mission included milking everything they could out of a basic 289 starting point and the Salt Flats were a great place to convince customers they weren't buying a poser. Stude didn't have a large displacement/HP engine to compete with the big 3 nor the time/money to get one ready, so just like others did later, they went for a blower. They did a darn good job, too. but sadly in the short and long run perhaps it was just for grins
At least your R2 is waaaay cooler than Mopar's later turbocharged 6 cylinder LeBaron! -
I'm guessing Studebaker Marketing folks didn't view the Avanti as primarily a performance car, in spite of the Granatelli brothers. The Marketing Department tends to be the tail that wags the dog in the auto industry.
Dennis
As talented as the Granitellis were, the Avantis were never a performance car IMHO, always more of a "personal luxury sport tourer". As 1962 drew to a close, what I think were 3 of the most beautiful cars ever built were new on the market; The Avanti, Corvette Stingray and Riviera. All cost about the same in starting trim and I think the Riviera was dead nose to nose competition with the Avanti. The first year Riviera had a base 401ci V8 engine with around 320hp. I had that same engine in a '63 LeSabre wagon and I have no doubt it could have stomped an R1 Avanti in the quarter mile. I just don't think the average daydreaming Avanti buyer really bought into an image of slamming through the gears at Watkins Glen compared to valet parking at the Wilshire.
Avanti Misinformation!
in Avanti Pub
Posted
Very true, IMHO a testament to the car still being remembered well, and often fondly.